Possible link


Murray
Thomas Albert = Jessie Rhoda (Murray)
b.?
see Chimneys on Fire from Garston and Woolton Weekly News, 10 February 1933
  ||
Robert James Thomas
b. April 2, 1912 See certificate b. 1918 West Derby
Possible death? 1995 (83) Liverpool
  ||
Pauline E Emmeline L
Birth 1946 Liverpool Birth 1949 Liverpool


Miriam
Birth 1968 Liverpool





Randall
Robert J Beatrice M Douglas R Louisa F Joan E M Leslie R
Birth 1912 Chippenham Birth 1914 Chippenham Birth 1917 Chippenham Birth 1920 Chippenham Birth 1923 Chippenham Birth 1925 Chippenham
Ms Littler =1931 Liverpool
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Jimmy Brind (Robert James Brind 1912-1995) who kept greyhounds but also told wonderful family stories.


Chris Burke 07 December, 2009, at 00:14 (via Facebook)

Thanks Jonathan, this has been a very old North West Brind issue. This guy fathered children in Liverpool until the 1920's and then disappeard. His son was my Uncle Jimmy (Robert James Brind) who was a great mentor and friend. I think he saw us as kindred souls and I know think thats because we both lost our fathers at a very early age. The second James looks a likely candidate.


Jonathan Brind 07 December, 2009, at 09:03 (via Facebook)

James A who died in 1942 was born in about 1904. I thought you said your James was born in 1869? Also James A who died in 1942 died in Woolwich not Liverpool.


Jonathan Brind 07 December, 2009, at 09:08 (via Facebook)

There are quite a few Robert Brinds but if you are talking about Robert E J who died in Liverpool in 1995 aged 83, he might have been born April 2, 1912, in Alverstoke Hampshire (see birth certs for second half of 1912... you can buy this online).


Chris Burke 12 December at 17:42 (via Facebook)

Robert EJ is Uncle Jimmy, I missed his funeral sadly but sent a wreath. I will look to get Jimmy's birth certificate, that should take me forward, Thanks Jonathan. His mother was Catherine Murray my maternal grandfathers sister.
Chris Burke 13 December, 2009, at 09:21 (via Facebook)

Hi Jonathan, thanks for your encouragement, I have now checked for a birth record and got one for 1912 at Alvingstoke, Hampshire. Robert James Brind. Its an excelent match showing Catherine Murray (my Grandfathers sister and the blood link with the Brinds for me) as the mother. I'm sending off for the brith certificate & I will see his daughter Shirely next month in Liverpool. Meanwhile do you or Jonathan have anything else on your CD? I feel a lot closer now to the missing link which is the mysterious Father of Uncle Jimmy who disappreared somewhere.

Registration district of Alverstoke
1912 BIRTH in the sub-district of Alverstoke in the County of Southampton
No When and
where born		 Name, if any Sex Name and surname
of father		 Name, surname and
maiden surname of mother		 Occupation of father Signature, description and
residence of informant		 When registered Signature of registrar Name entered after
registration
433 Second of April 1912
37 Clarence Square
Gosport UD		 Robert James Boy Thomas Albert Brind Jessie Rhoda Brind formerly Murray Private 2nd Wilts Regiment Jessie R Brind mother
37 Clarence Square Gosport		 Twentysecond April
1912		 Henry W Wells
Registrar		       /
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From: "Peter Gawn"
Subject: Cold Harbour & Clarence Square, Gosport.
Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2006 17:17:02 -0700

The brief exchange of postings in early June whetted my appetite. I grew up in Gosport but cannot remember any mention of Cold Harbour or Clarence Square so I dug around in reference material here and unearthed the tale - one that ends sadly. Others with Gosport roots might be interested, so here's a thumbnail sketch.

Cold Harbour is shown on 17th century maps as empty ground on the shore of Portsmouth Harbour just north of the buildings of the old town & of the site (then Fort Charles) where Camper & Nicholson's now is. Elegant Georgian houses were built in the 18th century on the north & south sides of the space & at an angle to each other, the shore side remaining empty. In the mid-19th century Cold Harbour was renamed Clarence Square. To the north of it was St Matthew's Church (built 1840) & Square & then the complex that became the Royal Clarence Victualling Yard.

By the beginning of the 19th century Cold Harbour was home to the gentry & was described as being a place of privacy & retirement when compared to the rest of Gosport town. It became "the usual resort for the evening promenade of the ladies and gentlemen of this town where the gay assemblage of beauty and fashion cannot but give a stranger the highest and most favourable ideas of the place." Quote from an 1801 book reproduced in "The Story of Gosport", L. White, revised edition 1989, p. 61-62.

Pigot's 1830 Directory lists 31 residents in Cold Harbour including 22 gentry, eight professional men and one shopkeeper together with Dr Burney's famed Naval Academy. The Academy, founded in 1788, flourished, under royal patronage, throughout the 19th century.

The number of resident gentry in Clarence Square had declined by the time White's Directory appeared in 1878, perhaps because of the attraction of Anglesey (in Alverstoke), an elegant watering place for retired naval officers and so on, dominated by The Crescent, that was begun in 1826. It seems likely that Clarence Square then went into a decline as did much of the old part of Gosport. Burney's Academy changed hands in 1892 and the new school moved to Surrey in 1904. Three years later Gosport's first elementary school, the Clarence Square School, was built on the site.

The economic conditions of the 1920s and 1930s were not kind to Gosport and many 18th-century buildings in the old town decayed or became little better than tenement slums. Proposed improvements were overtaken by the war in which three quarters of the town's 13,000 houses were damaged, including many of the impressive townhouses in Clarence Square. Post-war reconstruction was slow. Various schemes were discussed, including one that would have seen Clarence Square restored and another for a fixed-link ferry (to replace the Floating Bridge which ceased operation in 1959) or a tunnel across Portsmouth Harbour both of them between Cold Harbour and Portsea Hard. The final solution was the creation of a new road, Mumby Road, linking the old town to the north. Accordingly the remains of Clarence Square were bulldozed in the early 1960s. All that was left was a small section on the north side of Mumby Road.

I'm indebted to "The Story of Gosport", mentioned above, for much of the foregoing.

Peter Gawn

Sechelt, B.C., Canada.